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Arbitrage is a normal free market process that finds the optimal prices for things. Trying to regulate prices always results in gluts, shortages, and black markets.

Creating artificial shortage and than charging overprices is not a normal free market process. Businesses should create added value, then they can charge a price for it.

Actors that misuse or unfairly dominate free markets will trigger regulation, that's the way it has always been. Some regulators are weak, so we still have endure cancers like Google and Microsoft.

There is no artificial shortage, there is an inherent shortage. Sufficiently popular entertainers such that a ticket price arbitrage opportunity exists must be, by definition, in short supply.

There exist only so many performance days in an entertainer’s lifetime. And, obviously, venues have capacity limits.

So what is the added value created by those resellers to address the inherent shortage?
In theory they provide market liquidity such that for anyone who REALLY wants to go, at any time prior to and potentially even during the event, there remain some options available for purchase; as opposed to basically spinning the lottery on whether you get to go or not, especially for oversubscribed events.
Hmm, it seems like we've forgotten that we can vote with our wallet. If this practice wasn't desired because it raised prices too much or some other reason, then people wouldn't give the resellers their money.
This assumes the only dynamics are "the seller wants to make as much as possible" and "the buyer wants to spend as little as possible".

There are plenty of cases where the seller (artist, venue, etc) want to keep prices low to allow a wider audience to attend the show.

> There are plenty of cases where the seller (artist, venue, etc) want to keep prices low to allow a wider audience to attend the show.

There are only so many seats in a venue. Suppose there are 1000 seats and 5000 people want tickets. What's your plan on how to allocate them?

First come first serve, or a lottery, or any number of other algorithms. The point being "the people with the most money" isn't the algorithm that everyone wants.
In this case you can have concerts 2 or 3 days in a row.
Have you considered the possibility that this dogma is not accurate, and that in the US we actually have a market failure?
What market failure are you seeing here?
> Trying to regulate prices always results in gluts, shortages

When the demand is higher than the supply and supply is inelastic (which is the case for these kind of events) then there's no difference between unaffordable prices and a shortage.

The difference only exist for the upper class who can pay the inflated price anyway.

In a society where there are significant differences in income, the price signal is meaningless and it just segregates people by revenues.

If the price signal is meaningless, then why aren't the scalpers charging 100 times as much?
Do you know what the “price signal” phrase even mean?

Because this answer has absolutely nothing to do with price signal as a economic concept.

Are you assuming the goal is to find the optimal price?
It may lead to optimal profit but immensely hurt the society. Not everything should be optimized for profit.

If you are going after full profit optimization we are leaving huge amount on the table by offering billionaires food at prices that are insignificant for tem. Maybe we should start optimizing for the million dollar burgers then?

If the average Brit is spending %10 of their daily income for a meal, obviously its suboptimal for a person making a million a day to eat anything for less than 100K. In fact, it doesn't even have to have anything to do with percentages, maybe the meal can be optimized up until 999910GBP. Even the rich guy needs to eat, optimize the prices to the point that he has to choose between starvation and 999910GBP burger

seller agrees to sell ticket at $PRICE.

buyer agrees to buy ticket at $PRICE.

how is society hurt, here?

the government banning this is immediately harmful: it prevents a mutually agreeable trade that would otherwise have increased the utility of both parties.

People can't go to concerts despite being just as hardworking or just as big fans and start shooting CEOs on the streets.

Some systems need to work and be accessible to everyone so we can sustain peaceful and healthy society.

This is not charity, this is to account for externalities and the miscalculations in the free market. Awful lot of people are underpaid and overpaid as they progress through their lives because the markets are actually not that efficient and prices are not formed under perfect information or instantly.

You want your mechanical engineers to be able to afford decent life even if all the market current wants is JavaScript engineers because when the tides shift you may end up needing mechanical engineers to produce physical stuff so you want them around and happy.

Also, the price could actually be too low too when its optimized for short term profits. Re-sell 100GBP tickets for 500GBP, filter for money and leave out the actual fans and maybe lose all the events for the next year. If you are going to do a daytime robbery, better not ever need money again from the people you are robbing.

Not sure about your situation, but the only situation I ever experienced out there were scalpers getting ridiculous amounts of tickets beforehand, sometimes via shady contacts and then reselling them for profit.

What about some middle ground - allow sale for and below the purchase price and punish severely any profiteering? The only reason scalpers do it is for money - if the punishment and risk are big enough it solved itself.

Where I live, the biggest festival in whole country (Paleo @Switzerland) explicitly bans resale for some time and nobody real is complaining, its fair and tickets are sold within minutes of becoming available.

The last point - if some psycho is starting to shoot others because they can't go to some fucking concert then the underlying condition needs to be targeted, not sweeping reality in front of them so they never trip on some obstacle in real life. 'Eat the rich' trope is stuff immature frustrated kids tell to peers, nothing more.

Sure, the issue isn't ticket resale but profiteering that damages the scene. An alternative could be the tickets be assigned for the individual like plane tickets but be transferable so if someone is transferring tickets all the time you can block them.
> The only reason scalpers do it is for money

The only reason people work and run businesses is for money. Not doing it for money is called a "hobby", "charity" and "volunteering".

The "only" reason? What happened to "making the world a better place"?
> prices are not formed under perfect information

There is no requirement for perfect information in order for a free market to function. The term for lack of perfect information is "risk" and is factored in to negotiations and the price.

I wonder what would happen in a world where sellers have instant information about how rich the buyer is, and they all raise the offered price accordingly, for every product.
if they want to go to the concert they should pay the fair market price for a ticket. and in addition, they should refrain from murdering people, because murder is wrong.

the high ticket prices incentivise the creation of new venues and the entrant of new artists into the market. they indicate that the music industry is not supplying concerts in sufficient quantity/quality as the market demands, or perhaps not in the right places or at the right times. prices are a signal; you outlaw them at your peril.

this is a case where the monkey-brain fairness intuition is simply flat out 100% wrong. scalper economics has been studied for decades; it is known that banning these trades exacerbates shortages. lot of ppl in this thread who would not pass introductory microeconomics.

>> the high ticket prices incentivise the creation of new venues and the entrant of new artists into the market.

How does scalping, which transfers money from fans, artists, and the music industry to ticket touts who have nothing to do with music, "incentivise the creation" of anything? Except, I suppose, bot farms and clickfarm sweatshops?

>the high ticket prices incentivise the creation of new venues and the entrant of new artists into the market.

Always amuses me that the wannabe market experts ascribe theory of mind to markets. Personal risk tolerance and ability to execute without starving is what constrains supply of talent, who are not intrinsically born with either the knowledge or capability to begin the market based transaction process.

God (or your market) does not magically whip up concerts in response to spreadsheets. People taking risks do.

That would be an auction. Now we have a situation where a third party gets between seller and buyer, purchases large quantities of tickets then sells them for an inflated price to the buyer and both buyer and seller feel ripped off.
That's not an auction. It's just entity A selling to entity B and entity B selling to entity C.
Sorry, I should have quoted what I was calling an auction from the comment:

> a mutually agreeable trade that would otherwise have increased the utility of both parties.

That argument should be equally valid for US healthcare, prison phone calls, price gouging during natural disasters, housing prices, and college tuition.

Yet many people, possibly most people, feel something is broken.

Seller agrees to sell ticket at PRICE. Monopoly intermediate provider sells it at $PRICE+$markup. Monopoly intermediate provider sells it to a reseller, which artificially limits the supply available to buyers at any given moment. Buyers have to go to resellers, who then pay $markup2 back to the monopoly provider to transfer the ticket to the ultimate buyer. This may even repeat several times, resulting in the monopoly provider reaping more in markup fees than the seller receives for the actual product.
Original seller is free to sell it with the stipulation that original buyer is the only person that can use the ticket.

However, entertainers have an image problem that conflicts with the desire to maximize profit. Entertainers are often times in the business of appealing to the broader public. But if they restrict their ticket sales to the highest bidder, then the broader public's appeal is limited.

Having a third party engage in the price discrimination allows the entertainer's image to remain intact, while also collecting higher prices (perhaps not from the ticket sales directly, but the third party willing to pay more for the entertainer if the entertainer allows them to resell tickets).

why can’t I just pay ticketmaster the face value, why must we allow another middleman to charges me more? because capitalism? na mate
"Face value" is constantly changing. Why must you forbid someone from buying and selling something? If the performer has a problem with it, they can easily enforce ID requirements that require whoever buys the ticket first to be the person that attends.
Free markets optimize for utility. Profit is just a side effect of that.
Whatever it optimizes for, often it makes it everything fall apart due to short sightedness, unaccounted externalities and actual failure in optimization. Would have been all fine eventually if human life wasn't finite and suffering didn't exist.
Nobody has implemented a better system.
I think a moderately, responsively regulated market is usually superior to a strictly free market, personally.
IMHO this wanders into the realm of philosophy at this point because of the word “better”. You can always choose alternative KPIs and prioritize.

The KPI of profit has become harmful enough that people like Thiel observe that the system isn’t working anymore.

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