> Properly accounting for those externalities and adding them to the cost of renewable generation is possible, but politically unappealing.
Implying this was/is not done and should be done. As a certified fan of looking out for (cost) dependencies, I agree with this to put it very mildly. I find it unlikely this wasn't done however, rather, I think renewables were likely onboarded harder than the externalities were taken care of to allow for it, possibly due to political pressure and/or mismanagement. Or at least, that rings all too familiar to me personally, not just from real world topics, but even from work. But then what you actually propose is:
> There should be a limit on how much intermittent generation we can have depending on the preparedness of the grid and we should pay less for power from such sources, not guarantee purchase from them!
Which is a different concern.
Also, this reads to me awfully like just flowery language for "hey, what if the obviously bad thing that happened wouldn't be allowed to happen anymore" with the logic retconned into it, but then I'll never have a way of proving or demonstrating that conclusively.
Finally,
> We need to remove the existing subsidies on renewables which made sense in the early days, but not now. Let the generation sources play at the even field.
This further doesn't follow from even your own explanation (i.e. "which made sense in the early days but not now" is not a substantiated claim). It's just your own political stance on the matter to the best I can tell.
This is also factually incorrect (unless Spain are now doing some country level subsidies on renewables). Fact is, new solar and new wind offer the lowes average power generation costs of any method. Regular market forces (without susidies) will favor renewables over anything else. Hydro being the most profitable.
Market-based economies are great to follow technology trajectories and are efficient at capital allocation but even for them we need additional incentive structures to speed up the process.
I also think that most countries have massively reduced subsidies for new projects but existing subsidies will still be served for a long time.
Something like: the first 10Gw after start and the last 10GW before a stop make 50% of the revenue than the rest. That should disincentivize suddenly turning everything on or off depending on energy prices.
I'm glad people are coming around to accepting that renewable energy has problems. We have some solutions to these problems but we do not have experience with them.
I agree entirely - the externalities of renewable energy are significant and are not paid for by the source of the problem - the renewable generators themselves.
Just as one example, what is the solution to an extended wind drought, say of a week or ten days? All the batteries in the world could not store enough energy for that.
A major challenge with renewable energy is that it is intermittent and variable but also unpredictable. it is impossible to predict wind speeds more than 24 or 36 hours out and even those predictions are often inaccurate. just building more wind turbines or solar panels won't cut it.
There is also the reluctance of grid operators to use the capacity available in renewable energy generators. The majority of wind turbines are capable of active and reactive power control but most grid operators either don't use this capacity or use it minimally.
A distribution connected wind turbine could do wonders for reactive power control but this is rarely done. More grid operators should pay for reactive power, like the UK is starting to do. This should also be sourced from EVs and small solar inverters.
I wonder how much is the near-complete inability for grid operators to communicate with smaller systems. My little solar inverter is capable of reactive power control over a respectable range of phase angles, and the grid operator has absolutely no ability to invoke this ability short of whatever formula the combination of PG&E, the various regulators, and the UL stuck into some standard for how small inverters are supposed to behave under various voltage and frequency conditions.
Never mind that inverters could also be fooled into thinking they’re islanded and therefore disconnect themselves if the grid frequency is too far out of range. This is usually designed to occur at above-nominal frequency, which is at least mostly not what happened in this event.
This is all very much possible and the tech to do it is relatively basic. Grid operators do not because the market rules were written by larger generators to favour those larger generators.
I explicitly mentioned this line of argument in the GP. The problem is that renewables only sometimes cheap and plentiful and often not when we want it. Even without accounting for the politically-driven preferential treatment covered in the sibling comment, from the purely technical point of view intermittency above certain threshold wreaks havoc in the traditional grid architecture designed for the traditional easily controlled "rotating" generation. It becomes really hard to manage the grid with existing tools when you have too much of intermittent highly distributed generation and in the extreme it leads to collapses like this.
As I wrote, yes, you could upgrade the grid, increase transmission redundancy, add battery/pumped/flywheel storage, introduce "smart" tools to manage the grid, and do a plethora of other things to accommodate renewables. Hell, you could even migrate the grid to DC!
But the cost of doing it is substantial. It's effectively a form of externalities of renewable generation, which are not accounted for in naive "cheap" $/kW metrics. Properly accounting for those externalities and adding them to the cost of renewable generation is possible, but politically unappealing.
>Your comment suggests move back to good ol' expensive fossil generation instead of looking at how to bring the market rules up to date with evolving technologies.
No, I believe we should remove the politically motivated shoehorning of renewables at the cost of grid stability. There should be a limit on how much intermittent generation we can have depending on the preparedness of the grid and we should pay less for power from such sources, not guarantee purchase from them!
As you say, we should have proper incentives structure which accounts for various externalities (including CO2 emissions!). We need to remove the existing subsudies on renewables which made sense in the early days, but not now. Let the generation sources play at the even field.