Hacker Neue

Preferences
ethanpil parent
The OSX license agreement severely limits the practicality of this: http://images.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/macOS1012.pdf

It only allows you:

Section 2B(iii): "to install, use and run up to two (2) additional copies or instances of the Apple Software within virtual operating system environments on each Mac Computer you own or control that is already running the Apple Software, for purposes of: (a) software development; (b) testing during software development; (c) using macOS Server; or (d) personal, non-commercial use.

The grant set forth in Section 2B(iii) above does not permit you to use the virtualized copies or instances of the Apple Software in connection with service bureau, time-sharing, terminal sharing or other similar types of services."

Stratoscope
The part of that EULA section that really gives me trouble is "...that is already running the Apple Software...".

I want to run OSX in a VM on my MacBook Pro with Windows as the host OS. I used to do it the other way around, boot into OSX and run Windows in a Parallels VM. These days most of my work is in Windows, especially VR work, so it's more practical to boot into Windows. (And I like Windows better than OSX anyway.)

But I still do need to test on OSX occasionally. In an ideal world, since I have VMware installed on Windows, I could just boot up an OSX VM.

But because of that one EULA phrase, OSX will never be supported by a commercial vendor like VMware or a large open source product like VirtualBox - even on Mac hardware!

This leaves booting back to OSX as the only way to run it, and rebooting back and forth is a real pain.

All I want to do is run my legally licensed Windows and legally licensed OSX, and have it be my own choice which one to run as the host OS.

kristofferR
It's pretty easy to solve that issue by applying a community made fix: http://www.insanelymac.com/forum/files/file/339-unlocker/
Stratoscope
Thank you very much! That looks like a perfect solution for me.

I especially like the fact that it's Python source code, so I can look at the code and get some sense of comfort that it doesn't have anything sketchy in it.

y4mi
he'll still be in violation of the EULA though...
Stratoscope
I'm not too worried about that. I doubt if Apple will get on my case for running OSX on my MacBook Pro!
geofft
There is a "VMware Unlocker" tool of extremely questionable legality that can enable running OS X as a guest of VMware Player / Workstation on Windows.
snuxoll
The unlocker tool sits in the usual legal gray area of software mods, of course running macOS on non-Apple hardware is against the EULA.
xienze
You know, after spending sooooo many thousands of dollars on iPads, MacBooks, iPhones, iTunes, iTunes Match, and the developer program, I just can't bring myself to feel bad about running an instance or two of OSX in a VM.
curried_haskell
So...? Don't do this at work.

Who actually takes software licenses seriously in their own home?

cm3
I write software for free and as a living, so I surely take it seriously. How can a software developer justify stealing software, unless they're trapped in a poor or technologically restricted situation (Cuba)?

EDIT: There's some confusion as to what I replied to:

My reply is to this

    Who actually takes software licenses seriously in their own home?
If this doesn't imply one's okay with stealing, then I take my comment back.
josteink
> How can a software developer justify stealing software

Oh come on. Running a legally obtained OSX installation on hardware you own is hardly stealing.

I don't see why OSX "fanboys" constantly bring up this tiresome meme about OSX being this near "holy" OS which cannot run on anything but this similarly holy Apple hardware.

It's a generic consumer OS designed to work on what is mostly run of the mill X86 hardware. Get with the times.

cm3
My reply is to this

    Who actually takes software licenses seriously in their own home?
If this doesn't imply one's okay with stealing, then I take my comment back.

Because you seem to assume I use a mac, I must confess to not owning one and therefore not using macos.

josteink
I read it as "who cares about obscure constraints which if violated will severely limit my ability to get support should I need it", not as a blanket licence to pirate software.

Obviously in a professional context, you will care about things like support. But probably not for your lets have fun hackety hack project at home.

gakada
Think you're reading too much into it. Most software license agreements have silly rules and restrictions that nobody takes any notice of - at home. Businesses have to be more careful.
FreakyT
It's not "stealing" if you paid for a license. By your logic, jailbreaking an iPhone would constitute theft.
manarth
It's more akin to installing iOS on a Nexus phone.
FreakyT
Which, in turn, would be a pretty impressive achievement, and certainly worthy of an HN story.
n_yuichi
Agreed.

I am surprised at how many people on HN show negative attitude toward compliancy with the EULA. I thought HNers had a respect for software license.

FreakyT
I would hope that most people on HN are knowledgeable enough to agree with the EFF's take on EULAs -- they are of questionable legality, and "dangerous for consumers and innovators alike"[1].

[1]: https://www.eff.org/wp/dangerous-terms-users-guide-eulas

prodigal_erik
When a tool dictates how and where its human owner is allowed to use it, that's too dystopian for me to support.
karlmdavis
I do. I mean... seems pretty hypocritical for a coder who's made most of their income from software NOT to.
Symbiote
I'm sure there are plenty of us who've only written open source and/or bespoke software.
glibgil
Look, from a legal perspective this is a matter of civil procedure. For Apple to enforce this agreement it has to first discover your usage and then prove its damages in a court. The damages would likely be the cost of Mac hardware of equivalent power to the VMs plus legal fees.

What this means is that no one should spin up a server farm of OS X VMs and then blog about it. For everyone else, Apple is not going to discover you and if they do they are not going to pursue damages against you for the cost of a Mac Mini. Apple is just not out there doing that type of lawsuit

programLyrique
Is this EULA enforceable in every legislation or is it only an US issue?

Any specific information about the Apple EULA in the EU, for instance?

This item has no comments currently.