Comment by skipants - Hacker Neue

> radicalized me to believing we needed programming and computer science to be different majors.

Some universities offer Software Engineering as a BEng as well as CompSci as a BSc. At least in Canada.

But software engineering as a concept still isn't writing code. I'm a bit of a stickler about it as somebody who has an engineering degree, but when programmers with a CS degree say they're a software engineer, they're not. Software engineering as far as I understand it from the little bit I did in school is actually engineering. Requirements analysis, breaking down the problem, following methodology, etc. It's not just that they're writing somewhere.

So really there should be 3 fields of study: 1. The theory - computer science 2. How to apply the theory - software engineering 3. How to turn those designs into reality - programmers

It's like the mech engineering side. You have materials science and stuff, then mechanical engineers, then machinists.

Delk 4 days ago

For what it's worth, my computer science degree also had courses and projects that included requirements analysis, breaking down the problem, and elements of software engineering methodology and project management. (I believe we had a course titled "software engineering" even though the university doesn't award engineering degrees.)

I suppose in some schools computer science programmes might be fairly distinct from engineering ones. However, it seems that in lots of places a bachelor's in computer science is rather an generalist degree that covers lots of (mostly software) tech topics and some CS theory.

I'd still have trouble calling myself a software engineer, though, since I don't technically have an engineering degree, even though in lots of places my job might be described as such.

I also don't know a single programmer/developer whose job is distinct from field 2.

Genbox 3 days ago

I agree with this. As someone who took 3 degrees in computer science, one called "systems developer" and another called "software engineer", I can confidently say we have a taxonomy problem in computer science education.

It makes me crazy that companies labels there entire programmer workforce as "software engineers" when there are no engineering concepts involved at all. Other fields (medical, mechanical, civil engineering) are a lot more mature in this area and have solved this issue long ago.

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