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marcellus23 parent
Does this suggest at all that these changes could also be differences in the way (cis) men and women perceive the world? In other words, do cis women experience sweet food tasting sweeter, colors being more vibrant, etc, compared to cis men?

Edit: I’m aware there’s evidence for differences in color discrimination and taste preferences between the sexes. But seeing the differences described from a first person perspective of someone used to being a male is fascinating. It’s a common cliche that women laugh much more than men, for example — and here’s someone saying that being on estrogen made funny things seem much funnier. I wonder what the experience is like for FtM who take testosterone?


foxmoder
Anecdotal, but I found that my sense of smell improved significantly after a long time taking estrogen, and I've heard many similar one-off stories from other people who've done so too. It certainly does change your physical perception of the world in a few ways, as well as the general feeling of existing in one's body.

One recurring theme I've heard from people going from majority testosterone to majority estrogen is a feeling like a continuous 'buzzing' sensation in their head had finally stopped; this is something I personally experience, and there's a certain degree of relaxed serenity that comes with it for me. (This said, experiences vary a lot, and many who have had both primary hormones prefer the feeling of testosterone.)

I personally think that it's a beautiful opportunity to get to experience life through both sets of hormones; it's offered a lot of interesting perspective on my personal notions of 'self', and allowed me to develop empathy for different experiences others experience in their bodies.

marcellus23 OP
> many who have had both primary hormones prefer the feeling of testosterone.

This is super interesting! Do you know what they prefer about testosterone?

> One recurring theme I've heard from people going from majority testosterone to majority estrogen is a feeling like a continuous 'buzzing' sensation in their head had finally stopped

This is also fascinating. As a cis man is there a buzzing constantly that I don’t even notice, that none of the women in my life have?

foxmoder
It's a good question! My personal experience (which mostly echoes those I've heard) is that it tends to be a lot more of a rush in some ways; I recall feeling a lot more alert in some ways, and a lot more eager to quickly make decisions/launch into things.

I get a somewhat similar sensation with enough caffeine now, but the experience of testosterone in my experience is a lot more of a head-rush than caffeine is for present me.

It's kind of neat, because at the end of HRT cycles as the levels shift, it lets me experience varying proportions of one versus the other--it honestly surprised me a lot to experience for the first time how much hormones play into what it's like to be in my head day-to-day.

Ooh, and re: the last question, it's possible that that's something that not everyone experiences--I will say though that that's probably the best way I have to describe what I felt, even though I wouldn't say I actively noticed a buzzing sensation before I started HRT (when my doses are late though, it's definitely something I pick up on).

Fraterkes
Gendered cliches are incredibly common, but I’ve never heard one that involves women liking sweet food more or less than men, which you’d expect if there were actual differences in taste I think
vinoveritas
It’s an extremely common pattern for alcoholic drinks, to the point that a man ordering a very sweet drink or a woman ordering neat whisky is likely to draw comments (not even necessarily negative ones, especially in the case of a woman preferring usually-masculine drinks). It’s also present in wine marketing—the lower end of the market has heavily feminine-coded marketing and tends to be very sweet (at least in the US), and in fact that aligns with actual preferences I’ve observed (I’m not sure I know a single woman who prefers dry wines?)

Chocolate (dark vs milk) and coffee drinks (heavy on milk and sugar versus light on them, or black) follow similar patterns in perception (and actual observed preferences, IME)

Of course, how much of that is nature versus socialization is another matter… but also, the kind of risk-taking and one-upsmanship behavior that might drive men to be more willing to acquire tastes for things that aren’t initially appealing and to so-expand their palates may itself be hormonal, so even one plausible “nurture” cause for this might actually be “nature” one step removed.

But either way, and even if data doesn’t bear any of that out (pretty sure it would, though), the perception that all that’s generally true is certainly common.

wahern
Reminds me of the paper, "Stereotype accuracy: One of the largest and most replicable effects in all of social psychology": https://gwern.net/doc/psychology/cognitive-bias/2016-jussim....

TL;DR: Group stereotypes, at least on their face, tend to be quite accurate. It's the implications people draw from or apply to them that can be problematic.

jacobgkau
> I’ve never heard one that involves women liking sweet food more or less than men,

It's somewhat ingrained in (traditional) Japanese culture that women prefer sweet foods and men prefer spicy foods. Young boys enjoying sweets is seen as "funny" since they don't "know" it's a feminine thing yet (not necessarily in a "you can't do that" way, but more in a "cute that he hasn't picked up on it yet" way).

mintplant
Women are generally better at perceiving and distinguishing colors and smells, according to the studies we have. Anecdotally, my sense of smell has gone from dull to vibrant over the course of my (MtF) transition, and I have a friend who no longer experiences the color-blindness she used to before hers, though I'm not aware of any scientific evidence or inquiry in this area.
Women (here I mean XX individuals) have two different alleles present for each of the green (OPN1MW, also the OPN1MW2 duplication) and red cones (OPN1LW), since these are found on the x chromosome. X-inactivation means that only one gets expressed in a particular cell, but this means individual photoreceptor cells can express either allele. The individual proteins and gene encodings of the cones can differ, and small variations shift the spectral sensitivity to slightly shorter or slightly longer wavelengths. It's possible, then, for a woman to express as many as five unique-ish cones in theory -- though there's only been one 'true' tetrachromat found so far. Still, having red and green cone variants that respond with a peak preference shifted 10-20 nm in addition to another unshifted cone (or, better, shifted the opposite direction) provides a biological basis to expect women (again, specifically XX individuals) to have finer color differentiation. This explanation, however, could not occur following a hormone replacement.
mintplant
Like I said, unfortunately I'm not able to ground this in any kind of existing scientific research or provide a biological explanation! I can only self-report and relay the experiences of others that I know to be factual. It's a shame that this sort of thing seems under-studied.
DoctorOW
> Women (here I mean XX individuals)

This can be shortened to "XX individuals" since the word applies neither to all XX Individuals nor does your use of the word apply to all women.

RebeccaTheDev
I was not prepared for my food tastes to change! I used to love candy. But now I’m rarely drawn to it, but I will absolutely INHALE fruit. It has so much incredible depth of flavor now!
blindriver
You are assuming that people mostly experience the world in exactly the same way. That is a huge assumption that's likely to be wrong.
marcellus23 OP
What? How in the world did I make that assumption?
TheOtherHobbes
There are some established differences. Women have better colour, taste, and smell discrimination. Some women are tetrachromats with an extra colour sense, while men are more likely to have red/green colour blindness.

Men have better night vision, are more aware of motion, and are better at tracking location and judging distances.

antonfire
> Some women are tetrachromats with an extra colour sense, while men are more likely to have red/green colour blindness.

If I'm not mistaken, red/green color blindness is more common in men because it's caused my a mutation on the X chromosome (which men tend to have fewer of). I would guess a similar thing about tetrachromacy.

So those are probably unrelated to color-perception changes due to exogenous estrogen.

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