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He was named after the title of the ruler of Mars in a novel written by Wernher von Braun, so ultimate goal for him has to be Mars.

Settlement on Mars is out of one gravity well into another, so it's not clear if it's the best first location of a extraterrestrial human territory - Moon might be easier and more reasonable.

So the camp is split between Moon and Mars, and Musk has to be on Mars.


TheOtherHobbes
Mars is a desolate wasteland, and the Moon is an airless desolate wasteland.

There is zero chance of building a self-sustaining base on either within the next fifty years, and probably within the next century.

It's not a freight problem, it's an ecology problem. Designing a life support system that is stable and self-correcting and isn't in danger of running out of some essential raw material or element isn't just an unsolved problem, it's a barely considered problem.

Ironically - or perhaps not - it would be much easier to create a self-sustaining population of machines on Mars and/or the Moon than any project that relies on incredibly complex and messy human biochemistry.

ethbr1
> Designing a life support system that is stable and self-correcting and isn't in danger of running out of some essential raw material or element isn't just an unsolved problem, it's a barely considered problem.

Earth science closed loop ecologists since the 60s would like a word with you...

AngryData
And how many closed loop ecologies functioned for any significant length of time without constant resouces and parts from outside being put in? Not to mention without lead times of 9+ months on those supplies, and not having to worry about large pressure differences and leaks, radiation, or extremely abrasive enviroments?
ethbr1
The fact that a perfect solution hasn't been found doesn't mean that nothing has been (or is being) studied.

The entire point of Biosphere 2 was to run a closed system for long enough to discover unexpected causes of failure.

Aka science.

AngryData
Of course the science has to be done and is useful, but there is still a huge leap between doing it on earth and doing it in an entirely different body and harsher enviroment, and we haven't done it on earth despite many attempts.

Its not like its just some small details that need some fine tuning or funding to achieve and just around the corner. The scale of building just an empty multi-acre structure off earth to start would by itself dwarf all our previous space projects combined.

ethbr1
Yes and no. Part of the benefit of closed ecologies is that they're... closed.

So unravel the major dynamics on Earth, and as on another body with gravity and sunlight (to a first approximation).

more_corn
Biosphere and Biosphere 2 have entered the chat.
numpad0 OP
> Ironically - or perhaps not - it would be much easier to create a self-sustaining population of machines on Mars and/or the Moon than any project that relies on incredibly complex and messy human biochemistry.

I don't think that's even ironic. It's the only viable path.

It should be like: robots keep 3D printing and launching giant capsule parts into L1/L2, which are to be robotically welded with captured asteroid inside so that the inside can be filled with all sorts of minimum viable tools until it's good enough to host life, and then interested life on Earth can choose to inhabit them.

We are not going to be welding space sailboats in an Apollo suits on Lunar surface and taking breaks on space prefab shacks. That just is not going to work.

tuna74
You should read the novel Evolution but Stephen Baxter and find out what happens next with Mars.
KineticLensman
IIRC in Evolution civilisation collapses in the near future after some massive volcanic event and the few survivors revert to feral hunting apart from a few cryogenically preserved soldiers who all get very depressed about the situation and then die. Or something like that. Not sure how this is relevant to Mars.
ceejayoz
Baxter's fiction tends to take the line of "what we think of as humans will be very short lived on a galactic time scale, but life will be around".

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